Direct-to-video TRANSFORMERS animated movies?

[relak]

The way forward from a commercial point of view is Pixar-style family-orientated fare which snags adults with smart jokes and soul while keeping kids happy.

hence a couple other suggestions included a TF:Animated movie based around concepts that were planned for a season 4(like that powermaster prime)

Batman isn't owned by a toy company who are arguably their biggest rival.

Ok fine. Studio Bones then.

A couple of jokes aside they were diabolical, really bad stuff even compared to the DiC seasons.

Remember when i said a DTV production would allow experimenting with a variety of genre? ValorVVenom is my example for the comedy genre/

The most telling thing about Resolute is that it was, what, three years ago and there's no sign of anything similar happening, which I would say is validation that the demand and audience just isn't there

Most of the DC and Marvel DTV movies were one-off as well. That doesnt mean that there isnt a demand.

[Cliffjumper]

hence a couple other suggestions included a TF:Animated movie based around concepts that were planned for a season 4(like that powermaster prime)

What exactly is it about a continuity-laden in-joke filled show that was cancelled two years ago that screams "breakaway family hit"? Why is that a better option than Prime? Families will watch TF:P. Only fanboys would watch TF:A4, which would annihilate any slim chance of pulling in a more casual audience.

Remember when i said a DTV production would allow experimenting with a variety of genre? ValorVVenom is my example for the comedy genre

It really isn't especially funny, just in a couple of places.

Most of the DC and Marvel DTV movies were one-off as well. That doesnt mean that there isnt a demand.

So Marvel and DC DTV movies - there's one of each and no sign of anything further like that happening, yeh? Because that's the situation with Resolute. The Marvel and DC movies aren't one-off because there were other ones, direct sequels or not.

No, you're right - there's a massive demand, Hasbro just don't like making money because they're stupid. They saw the way Resolute put GI Joe back in the general public's consciousness and thought "Hey, this is genuinely popular and profitable! Let's not make anymore!".

[relak]

What exactly is it about a continuity-laden in-joke filled show that was cancelled two years ago that screams "breakaway family hit"? Why is that a better option than Prime? Families will watch TF:P. Only fanboys would watch TF:A4, which would annihilate any slim chance of pulling in a more casual audience.

THe issue is not about "better option". It's about OTHER OPTION. (going right back to "Exploring other stories that cannot be told otherwise if focused on the Tf Prime continuity).
I'm not a movie producer who can pop up new ideas at the blink of an eye. I'm just throwing suggestions around.
And so far, Tf: Animated IMO has come closest to what i feel is the "pixar standard" that you mentioned.

I dont mind if they are going to do Tf: Prime's own "Transformers: The Movie", like what someone else suggested. As long as it feels like a movie and not like a bunch of episodes stitched together. That's an issue i've had with many movies based off tv series is that they never challenge their own status quo.

A couple of jokes aside they were diabolical, really bad stuff even compared to the DiC seasons.

Actually for this i have........

To some extent it proves the chasm between "well received by the fans" and "runaway success"

Just beacause you felt it was bad, doesnt mean it wasnt a success.

So Marvel and DC DTV movies - there's one of each and no sign of anything further like that happening, yeh? Because that's the situation with Resolute. The Marvel and DC movies aren't one-off because there were other ones, direct sequels or not.

No, you're right - there's a massive demand, Hasbro just don't like making money because they're stupid. They saw the way Resolute put GI Joe back in the general public's consciousness and thought "Hey, this is genuinely popular and profitable! Let's not make anymore!".

No. Here;s the difference. Marvel and DC judge success by how well their shows are recieved by critics and the audience and how well THE SHOW ITSELF sells.
Hasbro judges success on how well the toyline sells, irregardless of whether the show is good or not.
As far as i have read, G I joe REsolute got great reviews. Just that the toyline wasnt that hot.
(Going back to what i said about selling THE SHOW and not for the show to sell toys)

[Skyquake87]

Thing is though, transformers is a toyline first and everything else is secondary.

I doubt hasbro would contemplate a film without a toyline.

This is where both transformers and g.i. Joe differ from stuff like marvels superheroes that existed in a different media format that allows for exploitation and spin offs into other formats and media.

[Skyquake87]

Sorry for double post

marvel's stuff has always been pitched at a teenage audience. You can't say the same for transformers which has the 'stigma' of being a children's toy to get over before you get anywhere.

Yes the bay films will have helped to a degree, but again these were pitched at a family audience as they were aware of the likely appeal of the subject matter.to reach that audience you'd have to do the same

[Cliffjumper]

And so far, Tf: Animated IMO has come closest to what i feel is the "pixar standard" that you mentioned.

Yes, it has, probably. But being a sequel to a long-cancelled show would take that away from it. Any ties to any continuity would threaten its' chances with a wider audience. So the best thing is some sort of reboot featuring familiar characters remixed slightly. Prime does this, so there's no need for anything else.

Just beacause you felt it was bad, doesnt mean it wasnt a success.

Was it a success? After VvV there was just Sigma 6 (a total rethink and change of direction), the film and Resolute before Renegades started. What made the CGI films a success?

As far as i have read, G I joe REsolute got great reviews. Just that the toyline wasnt that hot.
(Going back to what i said about selling THE SHOW and not for the show to sell toys)

There wasn't a Resolute toyline. Figures based on the show were tagged into the 25th Anniversary line something like 18 months later (sold entirely in fan-orientated multipacks). The cartoon itself clearly didn't do enough to get sequels.

marvel's stuff has always been pitched at a teenage audience. You can't say the same for transformers which has the 'stigma' of being a children's toy to get over before you get anywhere.

Nail, head. The DC/Marvel DTDVD efforts simply are not a straight comparison. Their standard cartoons (such as the DC Timmverse) have a proven record of appealing to a wider, older audience making the Direct to DVD films a lot more viable. Their comics still sell 40,000 copies a month up before you consider TPBs and the like. A fair few of the bigger names are genuine cultural icons. They simply are not a viable comparison to Transformers and it's naive and stubborn to continually suggest they are.

[Cliffjumper]

I also double post.

Thinking further on the comparison with the DC and Marvel films it's worth considering once more just how established they are. Who would be the newest superhero to break into being a genuine well-known established mainstream 'name'? That's part genuine question, because my reckoning is it's Wolverine, maybe Rogue or Storm. I'm certainly struggling to think of anyone to arrive in the past 30 years to genuinely establish themselves of a big hitter - I've a nagging feeling I've forgotten someone, but not many.

DC/Marvel films don't sell themselves on the quality of the show, they sell themselves on the back of long-established big name characters generally acting the way everyone expects them to. They don't tend to break a lot of new ground and if anything tend to be watered down - the 'default' setting for the characters if you like.

The name of the animation studio, the quality of the script and so on are secondary selling factors to decades of being short-hand for an entire genre. With rare exceptions this is actually reflected in the box office takings of comic-based films - second division characters such as Daredevil and Ghost Rider remain second division in the cinema simply because a good chunk of non-comic fans don't really know who they are. Batman, however, always sells (Batman & Robin, despite diabolical reviews, still took nearly twice its' budget, and was still followed by a slew of series and then a cinema reboot).

[Terome]

sells (Batman & Robin, despite diabolical reviews, still took nearly twice its' budget, and was still followed by a slew of series and then a cinema reboot).

Now that I live on a university campus, I have learned to my quiet horror that Batman & Robin is considered the definitive Batman to a whole generation who saw it when they were in the target market. I often hear about how dopey and overreaching the Nolan movies are.

[inflatable dalek]

Whilst it's almost tailor made for student post pub watching I do genuinely think Batman and Robin is a great kids film, my little cousin absolutely loves it and she and I will often quote random Arniness at each other ("You're not sending me to the cooler!"). I think it fails to be as fun for sober adults as even Batman Forever was, which is a shame (the Adam West show proves it's possible to do both at once, I think that worked because everyone involved was playing it straight despite the gags which means it arguably even gets better the older you get) but I think it says a lot of Batman's flexability as a character that you can have great films aimed squarely at the older audience and at the very least a fun one for the under 10's all about the same character. Even with someone as equally well established like Superman it's hard to see imagine in both an Adam West style show and the Nolan films.

Thinking further on the comparison with the DC and Marvel films it's worth considering once more just how established they are. Who would be the newest superhero to break into being a genuine well-known established mainstream 'name'? That's part genuine question, because my reckoning is it's Wolverine, maybe Rogue or Storm. I'm certainly struggling to think of anyone to arrive in the past 30 years to genuinely establish themselves of a big hitter - I've a nagging feeling I've forgotten someone, but not many.

Yeah, it's worth remembering that even Iron Man was relatively obscure (at least in the UK, is he a genuine household name in the states?) before his film came out. How well that did (and how good it wound up being) certainly took me by surprise. Indeed, of the four solo Avengers the Hulk was pretty much the only one you could guarantee that most of the audience would already be really familiar with.

I think the key is to having a successful film/TV/radio (if the character is that old) showing fairly early on in the characters career. As well selling as Spider-Man's comics were the 60's cartoon would have been seen by millions of people a week more (and of course sold to countries that might not otherwise have had their own comic yet).

As for the last breakout character... I suppose the Avengers now being one of the most successful films ever made means that Loki, Hawkeye and Black Widow have suddenly and belatedly reached the big time. Nick Fury as well maybe, if the Hoff film wasn't big enough to manage it.

EDIT: Dang, somehow missed the word "Newest" in the bit I was quoting... Still, if nothing else, it shows you should never say never.

[relak]

After VvV there was just Sigma 6 (a total rethink and change of direction), the film and Resolute before Renegades started. What made the CGI films a success?

Hell if i know. It definitely wasn't the show itself.

And here's the thing. Hasbro is "single line" in its thinking. The insistence that there is only 1 incarnation of the team at any given point. It's not as if REsolute was released while Renegades series was ongoing. (which is precisely what im suggesting)

While WB was churning out episodes of BRave and the Bold, it was also releasing Green Lantern First Flight and Superman/Batman: Public enemies. While Marvel Animation was churning out episodes of Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heros, they also released Planet Hulk and Tales of ASgard (along side the Marvel anime line of Iron Man and Wolverine too)

The cartoon itself clearly didn't do enough to get sequels.

Now which is why i believe that the reason REsolute did not continue was not because it did not sell well.
It was because Hasbro had a new toyline out and wanted to push that with a new show.
With their "single line" thinking, that means Renegades goes into production and everything else is stopped no matter how well it did. Wont be the first time Hasbro killed off something good just to get new toys out and a show to go along with it.

Figures based on the show were tagged into the 25th Anniversary line something like 18 months later (sold entirely in fan-orientated multipacks).

And they could have easily used that (since there are a lot less fans than kids) to justify "toys didnt sell well"

Their standard cartoons (such as the DC Timmverse) have a proven record of appealing to a wider, older audience

Thats cos a talented team of Bruce Timm and Paul Dini MADE THEM appeal to a wider older audience.
Remember prior to the Timm DCAU Batman existed as campy Adam West, Filmation's equally campy Batman, Justice League was the definitely child pandering "Super friends" etc. Most DC comic cartoons prior to the 90s were as child oriented as Transformers until a talented team came along and made them something more.

second division characters such as Daredevil and Ghost Rider remain second division in the cinema simply because a good chunk of non-comic fans don't really know who they are.

The example of Iron Man is a good one. Prior to the LAM, Iron Man was nearly a second stringer himself. A "mid range seller" constantly outsold by X titles, Spiderman, FF and even fellow avengers solo series. Got better during the Michelinie and Ellis runs apparently but its true peak was thanks to the LAM.

I doubt comic popularity or longevity helped sell the films.
Men in Black TROUNCED all the X-men films despite X-men being immensely more popular in comics and longer lived.
Similarly "THe Mask" trouncing GReen Lantern (even despite the film being released just after the Green Lantern centered comic events like Blackest night)
Or even a one off comic like "Wanted" trouncing Hulk.

[Cliffjumper]

It was because Hasbro had a new toyline out and wanted to push that with a new show.
With their "single line" thinking, that means Renegades goes into production and everything else is stopped no matter how well it did. Wont be the first time Hasbro killed off something good just to get new toys out and a show to go along with it.

And they could have easily used that (since there are a lot less fans than kids) to justify "toys didnt sell well"

Resolute was released in early 2009. Renegades entered production in 2011. The toys were released in 2010 due to a mixture of fan demand and running out of ideas for the 25th Anniversary line. Please don't twist facts.

Thats cos a talented team of Bruce Timm and Paul Dini MADE THEM appeal to a wider older audience.

No, it means they've also gathered a cult following with no idea of what makes something genuinely mainstream (hello!).

Iron Man was nearly a second stringer himself. A "mid range seller" constantly outsold by X titles, Spiderman, FF and even fellow avengers solo series. Got better during the Michelinie and Ellis runs apparently but its true peak was thanks to the LAM.

"Nearly a second stringer". So actually a first stringer? Iron Man has been in and around Marvel's best sellers as long as it's been running. So it's behind six or seven other Marvel series? OH OBSCURE!

I doubt comic popularity or longevity helped sell the films.
Men in Black TROUNCED all the X-men films despite X-men being immensely more popular in comics and longer lived.
Similarly "THe Mask" trouncing GReen Lantern (even despite the film being released just after the Green Lantern centered comic events like Blackest night)
Or even a one off comic like "Wanted" trouncing Hulk.

Will Smith post-Independence Day, Jim Carrey post-Ace Ventura, Angelina Jolie. Those are the reasons those three films did well at the box office. 99.99% of people who saw those films didn't and still don't realise they were based on pre-existing material. I haven't seen Wanted, but MiB and the Mask bear very little in common with the source either.

I fail to see how any of this ties in with your arguments for DTDVD TF films - take a huge box office star, put them in a name-only big budget Hollywood production, ????, profit.

Yeh, I can totally see how that proves a mature-aimed animated TF film on DVD would shift units.

[Skyquake87]

The Batman Animated Series by Dini & Timm was 'more grown up' because the first Burton film had rescued the series from the perception widely held by the public that Batman was campy nonsense, thanks to the '60s TV series.

The thinking behind the B:TAS was to bring some of that new grown up sensibility to the new cartoon. It wasn't done because anyone was trying to 'break the mould' or anything, but was simply riding the coat tails of a hugely successful film that a lot of kids had seen. Hell, it even uses the film's Elfman score for the theme.

Having reintroduced Batman as a serious proposition, its no surprise the cartoon follows in the same suit.

Not that any of this is a bad thing, as the cartoon is still probably one of the greatest kids cartoons ever made.

I'd also venture the opinion that the various spin-off Animated films 'Mask Of The Phantasm' etc did well enough to encourage similar films down the line - in continuity or not. But whom are these selling to? Fanboys will pick them up, because, well, without being rude, they're fanboys (i include myself in this - its why I own the Ghost Rider film, even though its sh*t and can't stand the Blaze GR), but the appeal for animated stuff in the West, as pointed out by Cliffy, is with kids and/ or family audiences.

Transformers does the same with TF:Prime. The Bay films have an approach that has been borrowed by TF:P, the cinematic scope, similar looking Animation models, a filmic score - its basically the TF equivalent of B:TAS.

With any venture along the lines you're thinking, the best you can hope for is something with the smarts of those two properties. Anything too serious and / or earnest -or unfamiliar- is going to sink like a stone, which is ultimately the fate of Beast Machines. Christ knows what kids watching that made of it.

[relak]

Resolute was released in early 2009. Renegades entered production in 2011. The toys were released in 2010 due to a mixture of fan demand and running out of ideas for the 25th Anniversary line. Please don't twist facts.

Dude, YOU dont twist facts.
Renegades was released in november 2010. Meaning it must have gone into production sometime in 2009 or latest by early 2010.
Which immediately after G I Joe REsolute. (Resolute premiered in april 2009 with its DVD release only in november)

"Nearly a second stringer". So actually a first stringer? Iron Man has been in and around Marvel's best sellers as long as it's been running. So it's behind six or seven other Marvel series? OH OBSCURE!

The only times Iron Man has been in and arond the best sellers is during the Michelinie run (Late 70s and Armor wars event but then again event titles get a sales boost all the time), Warren Ellis' reboot (but then again most if not all reboots get into the best sellers anyway) and the everything after the LAM (thanks to the LAM).

The past 6 or so years does not make up for nearly 2 decades floundering in mediocre sales level.

Yeh, I can totally see how that proves a mature-aimed animated TF film on DVD would shift units.

Dude, AGAIN, you're not getting my point.

Mature themed is JUST ONE OF THE GENRE THAT A DTV PRODUCTION CAN EXPLORE.
Even so, i never expect Transformers to be the Matrix or anything. Something as mature as the TF:The Movie, Beast Machines or even the current TF:Prime is good enough.

Going back to the point that a DTV production frees up stories that can be told without confining it to the TF: Prime continuity.

I fail to see how any of this ties in with your arguments for DTDVD TF films - take a huge box office star, put them in a name-only big budget Hollywood production, ????, profit.

Doesn't that kinda tie into what i sugested about getting renown animation directors, a well know animation studio and possibly some celebrity guest voices?

With any venture along the lines you're thinking, the best you can hope for is something with the smarts of those two properties. Anything too serious and / or earnest -or unfamiliar- is going to sink like a stone, which is ultimately the fate of Beast Machines. Christ knows what kids watching that made of it.

That IS what im hoping for actually. Anything that is not "for kids only" (see Rescue Bots).

But for example, unlike a TV series that has to be an ensemble piece to showcase the entire team of toys, DTV projects can focus more on characterisation.
Maybe have character origins (like the suggested War on Cybertron Optimus Prime Origin or even a full origin tale for TF: Prime's Megatron) or "Spotlight" tales.

The second advantage is the benefit of a bigger and more focused budget and a larger production time window. Which can allow a DTV movie to show off things that would be near impossible to pull off on a TV series schedule (like maybe CGI hair that doesnt look like clay, or battle among a cast size equal to that of G1)

The third is that it does not need to be confined by the TF: Prime Continuity or to 3D CGI. DTV Projects can use a variety of art and animation styles from the minimalist simplicity of TFA to the complex sheen and shadows of japanese cel drawn anime.

The Last advantage is that it does not have to set up multiple plot points and run the risk of fumbling the endgame (like what TF Prime seems to be heading now without much of a focus). A DTV production is just one self contained story with a definite end.

[poyguimogul]

FYI, resolute was never shown on TV in Americana as it was "too violent"

It was cut into like 9 or 10 mini-webisodes, and shown on Cartoon Networks adult programming block ADULT SWIM's website. one webisode at a time for x weeks. It had a large number of views, but who knows if it's success lead to Renegades. (hundreds of thousands but I attribute that to sole distributor)


Resolute murders Renegades in every way possible, but obviously isn't gonna score the kid money. -most likely it grabbed a few anime fans, who may have stuck around to Renegades, but who knows if they stayed after that.


________________________________________________________________

Scramble City was direct and it didn't even get an ending till
"Thief in the Night" aired in Japan. (though JP had a different Market)

Zone was direct, and i can't imagine it helped that much, before the G2 rebranding / subline ? (probably not too much, as American sales slipped, and the JP only got 1 and 1/2 more mangas to support fledgling toylines) and even then it died down to Beast Wars.

______________________________________________________________

A profit netting show to Cartoon Network / AdultSwim is 250,000
A profit netting show to ABC/NBC/FOX is over 3,000,000

[Cliffjumper]

Dude, YOU dont twist facts.

Typo re: 2010/11.

The twisting facts was in reference to your ignorant comments ("Now which is why i believe that the reason REsolute did not continue was not because it did not sell well") regarding Resolute being canned for poor toy sales. It goes like this:

- Resolute was commissioned and screened without any plans for toys. I'm 99% sure Hasbro explicitly stated this.
- Eighteen months later due to a mixture of fan demand and declining options for the 25th Anniversary line they issued some figures based on it in a fan-orientated wave of giftsets (very common practice for the Joe line, as the inventory of body parts and relative lack of expense for moulds has lead to some very obscure characters being revisited).

Therefore, Resolute's success or otherwise was not dependent on toy sales, just the success of the animation itself. How exactly this was measured only Hasbro can know, but there was plenty of time to commission a sequel or two and still do Renegades when they did had it been that much of a success. SpyTroops was followed by VvV a year later then Ninja Battles the same year, so had Resolute been enough of a success there would have been plenty of time for an early 2010 sequel while still leaving the decks clear for Renegades in nine months (or whatever) time.

The only times Iron Man has been in and arond the best sellers is during the Michelinie run (Late 70s and Armor wars event but then again event titles get a sales boost all the time), Warren Ellis' reboot (but then again most if not all reboots get into the best sellers anyway) and the everything after the LAM (thanks to the LAM).

Wrong. It was a strong seller right from the sixties - there's no real shame for a Marvel book being behind Spider-Man, F4, Avengers (which, y'know, featured Iron Man from time to time), occasionally Cap, later X-Men and very few others. It wouldn't still be running unbroken otherwise. The character has also appeared in a two-season animated series during this time. It's had even greater sales at the point you mentioned (both Busiek and Quesada also had very successful runs), and did have a film that punched slightly above its' weight. But to suggest Iron Man was never a big hitter before Downey Jr is daft.

There being other comics that sell even better does not mean a comic does not sell well. That simple.

Also the industry's contraction means the post LAM stuff is probably selling less than half that even an unspectacular 1970s issue was selling.

Mature themed is JUST ONE OF THE GENRE THAT A DTV PRODUCTION CAN EXPLORE.

And it's just one that makes no sense.

Even so, i never expect Transformers to be the Matrix or anything. Something as mature as the TF:The Movie, Beast Machines or even the current TF:Prime is good enough.

The Matrix? Lofty ambition there. The key there is "the current TF: Prime is good enough". Why should Hasbro think any different? They already have a show that seems to be appealing to kids, families and fans for the most part.

Doesn't that kinda tie into what i sugested about getting renown animation directors, a well know animation studio and possibly some celebrity guest voices?

Nope, not really. Those 'adaptations' were major cinema films, not DTV projects. No-one cared who directed any of them - seriously, who can name the director of The Mask without looking it up? Who can name the studio that made Men in Black? All three films were sold on special effects and box office stars (both Smith and Carrey have arguably never been hotter than when they appeared in MiB and the Mask respectively).

How does this apply to DTV projects? Bargain bins are littered with animated films with a few celebrity voices mindlessly drummed up that did nothing for sales.

I'm not even bothering picking through the rest of your wish-fulfilment list, because the bottom line is that you want this to happen and are prepared to ignore any logic brought up in dissent so you can pretend it's just Hasbro keeping your dreams down. I'm banging my head against a brick wall here.

[inflatable dalek]

Thinking about it, in the UK, the most recent comic character to have really gone mainstream would be Judge Dredd wouldn't it? Still over 30 years ago, but he's a bit of an odd one out as he managed it through controversy rather than any media tie ins. So obscure outside our fair isle though that most foreign types would recognise the title only as that Stallone film that was like a less good Demolition Man and the new film is being done on the extreme cheap.

Nope, not really. Those 'adaptations' were major cinema films, not DTV projects. No-one cared who directed any of them - seriously, who can name the director of The Mask without looking it up? Who can name the studio that made Men in Black? All three films were sold on special effects and box office stars (both Smith and Carrey have arguably never been hotter than when they appeared in MiB and the Mask respectively).

One of the smarter things Marvel have done really is to realise the characters have enough clout so as not to need big name directors or actors in the lead role. The directors especially have all been picked for being right for the film and I don't think would have been a shoe in for a major blockbuster at any other studio (even Whedon, lets not forget his only other film was a flop, he's got good credentials with people who'd have gone to see it no matter what but most of the audience would never have heard of him. Most of the main audience of kids wouldn't even have been born the last time he had a successful TV show on. Equally it's been a while since Johnson's last hit and Lord Ken is hardly the first name you think of in big Hollywood terms).

[relak]

Typo re: 2010/11.

forgiven

How exactly this was measured only Hasbro can know, but there was plenty of time to commission a sequel or two and still do Renegades when they did had it been that much of a success.

Now that is questionable.
Hasbro has been known to put things on indefinite hiatus or to completely cut off a previous property in order to concentrate on a newer property. (which is the current fate of Renegades while Hasbro is concentrating on the Live action) Which is why i suspect the reason behind Resolute not getting a sequel is a combination of these factors
- the Renegades property and the need to push it
- Warren Ellis moving on to work with Marvel animation

SpyTroops was followed by VvV a year later then Ninja Battles the same year

If i recall correctly both Spy Troops and VvV were already planned to be made anyway to coincide with the toys that were getting released on year apart in 2003 and 2004 respectively.
So it wasnt as if the show was successful or not, they were made to push the toys primarily. Hence the fact that Spy troops and VvV followed one another can't be used to reflect the situation of REsolute in which there was no toyline to coincide with.

Wrong. It was a strong seller right from the sixties

Sales Figures or no dice.
PRetty much every comic book resource page has cited Iron Man as a second tier seller compared to other comics of the time until the live action movie.
Heck during the 90s it was behind GHOST RIDER (your so called second division character)
http://www.comichron.com/titlespotlights/ironman.html

http://www.comichron.com/titlespotlight ... rvol2.html

It's had even greater sales at the point you mentioned (both Busiek and Quesada also had very successful runs)

Greater sales COMPARED to other marvel titles (im not even looking at Superman and Batman or the Image titles that got all the sales in the 90s)

That (the Busiek era) was during the post Heroes Rebon reboot. All reboots get high sales then dwindle off, which is exactly what happened to iron man until Warren Ellis came along. And even during that reboot, it ran behind the other rebooted titles.
Even during Busiek's run issue 1 was 6th place. Not bad, but you can chalk it up to the trend of all 1st issues. But issue 2 and 3 subsequently fell to 36th and 98th place respectively
After 1998 which saw a figure of around 150,000 it continually fell to 90,000 (approx) the next year and continued falling right down to barely 40,000 before Warren Ellis' Extremis reboot.Yet titles like FF and Spiderman still manage to hover around the 100,000 mark while Iron Man was floundering.

They already have a show that seems to be appealing to kids, families and fans for the most part.

Yet one that seems to favor pushing new toys over telling good story.
One that, as a series, is limited by its budget, its schedule, and the need to open multiple plot points rather than focus on one.
A dTV production can have that focus. (afore mentioned character spotlights, untold origins etc that would just break the ongoing narrative if shoehorned into an ongoing series)

sold on special effects

see DTV project sold on stellar animation

[Skyquake87]

Iron Man is a second teir character...he's sold consistently and continuously, but is nowhere near as recognisiable as Spider-Man and the X-Men (at least he was prior to the LAM).

Now, GR is a third teir (or less) character. That character has been the most enduring of Marvel's modern creations, but can't keep a book going.

Pointless reboots aside, Iron Man has been in continuous publication since 1963.