Transformers: More than Meets the Eye season two discussion

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 3:51 pm

I've re-read it three times and I just get more and more annoyed at the handwaving away of Cyclonus/Tailgate/Megatron/Getaway business from last issue. Tailgate apparently resurrected Thunderclash last issue and it's given a big old case of "meh". The Froid/Sunder stuff is really good but all leads back to Super Duper Skids And His Missing Memories. And the obvious thing from the reveal is this is probably going to be the missing link between Roller and 'Tarn' but Roberts will probably bring Trailcutter back to life to finish the DJD arc off because no-one can stay dead in this book. I guess I'm genuinely angry that the emotional gutpunch of the end of the last issue was undone inside of two pages.

Red Dave Prime · Post by **Red Dave Prime** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 5:50 pm

Very much undermined the "goodbye little one" line I felt

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 2:34 pm

I've tried and tried to find something about this issue to like, because I don't want to join the TFA Grump Patrol, but holy hell it's damn near impossible. If you haven't read it yet, let me summarise it for you:

- 17 pages of we get to the bottom of Skids and He Who Would Be Tarn In The Future know each other, except we don't because we need a cliffhanger, and along the way we'll concentrate on the irritating self-insert to get there
- 3 pages of Did the last issue make you feel something even though we got there in a clumsy fashion? Well, forget all that because it's not important any more, and the important stuff that came out of that issue we're going to handwave because DJD

Terome · Post by **Terome** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 3:26 pm

Yeah, I'm not quite over the Cyclonus-is-fine-thanks thing. Going to ruminate on it for a while and do a reread.

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 4:05 pm

The Cyclonus scene was just bizarre, him being OK was arguably inevitable (and it was a nice twist to have Tailgate actually be the one who came out worse from it. Though this basically meant he's on death's door again. For a moment I thought this was an issue set during the end of Remain in Light), but after the Big High Drama of the end of last issue it being resolved in a rather rapid and breathless recap was just...odd. Especially with it being used to wrap up the Thunderclash is ill stuff as well.

And "Book him Dano" seemed a strange fate for Getaway, though I guess we'll have to see how that goes. If it's anything like Brainstorm everyone will be his best mate again in six months.

A very disappointing sequence that may actually be the worst bit of MTMTE to date. It actually felt more like Cliffjumper had written a spoof of the series mocking all the things he doesn't like about it.

But...

I loved the Skids stuff. It was nice to see Rung doing some effective psychiatry after my previous gentle mockery of him, with the added irony of it coming just before the reveal he's been struck off. I told he he wasn't a good psychiatrist! The rivalry with Froid was nicely awkward as well.

The flashbacks were very Eugenesis, and I think we all would have worked out who Skids was going to meet at the end of the issue, but it was well done and very grim with the whole idea of the mouth spikes and giving faceplate characters a mouth by force was just delicious.

Loved the mines as well, presumably they're the same sentient bombs mentioned back in Chaos Theory?

And Skids doesn't consider Prime his friend. Interesting...

Sunder was basically a plot device, but a deliciously creepy one and the sight of him with Rung's eyes in his own was a great image.

There's some very good stuff in this issue, but a lot of it will depend on how much you care about the lengthy Skids subplot. So Warcry is going to hate it.

Let's just hope next month we don't skip forward a week before being told by the newly reformed Getaway how Froid was stopped by a slippery banana skin.

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 4:16 pm

I actually liked the Froid and Rung stuff but it all felt so contrived and forced and I'm still not over the Cyclonus stuff. I'm actually mad at myself for getting mad at three pages of a twenty page book that I hate the rest of the book. Roberts also has an annoying tendency to rely on such a small group of characters to base his stories around, I'd have loved this more if it had been someone like Hound or Doublecross or Siren or Hosehead or Aquafend or any of the 170 odd bots on the ship rather than Skids Has A Revelation That Sets Up An Arc Part 2.

Post by **Denyer** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 6:56 pm

Red Dave Prime wrote:Very much undermined the "goodbye little one" line I felt

Would sequence better with a "if this is the end then" prefix, but glad to see my impression of some random Autobots not being on the same level as an individual that's survived so much for some long was basically upheld. Enjoyed this one more than last issue, and maybe Tailgate can stay in sickbay for a few months now.

I generally don't mind tension being resolved by characters actually acting reasonably or realistically, personally.

Ranged memory attacks are an interesting one, and with precedent (Soundwave). Flashbacks again prove that the war doesn't have to be current to provide a rich source of narrative. And loved the Charger and Octus cameos.

Only just found out the holiday special exists, so am going to download and snag a copy of that off eBay...

Knightdramon · Post by **Knightdramon** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 8:20 pm

I thoroughly enjoyed it. Pre-current day stories are always great, we finally get to see parts of Grindcore, and in a strange twist, see Quark and by next issue see how he met his end/changed to something else. Kaon maybe? That'd be funny [purely speculation/body type].

Not sure why it's a big deal that the issue focus on Skids---despite being on a ship with 200 odd bots, I thought that nearing 50 issues it's clear that there's a very specific main cast and the rest are background fodder or random stories fodder. Skids's memories have been an integral part of his character since almost day one.

I found it amusing and fitting to end the Cyclonus "lives or not?" thing on such a tone; the previous issue was of a much more sombre and dark tone, so a light "yeah you're ok and he passed out" bit is ok by me.

Loved the Sunder bits and how creepy that whole bit is; there's definitely far more to see. Really like his Predator-esque "mandibles", and he'll be good as the main "baddie" of issue 49's solicitation/story.

Speculation on Grindcore---Skids joins Roller/Tarn as a DJD undercover mole on the first iteration? Skids has a hand in Quark dying? Quark is rebuilt and shadowplayed as somebody else? If this is all connected and Skids tells Brainstorm, perhaps the big ending of S2 would be Brainstorm taking his first life---Tarn?

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 12:14 pm

Though I imagine you're reserving the right to completely change your opinion should it be any word other than "Roller" being blocked out?

Knightdramon · Post by **Knightdramon** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 12:15 pm

Nah---I've been going on about this almost ever since Shadowplay pt 2 came out. Issue...10?

Although I'll laugh a lot if after all these cues and hints it's somebody else.

Red Dave Prime · Post by **Red Dave Prime** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:33 pm

Second read (and a third actually) helped this issue along. its got some bits I really liked and I thought Sunder was creepy as hell. Also the skids stuff worked well for me. I've made me case about Roberts having his core cast and after nearly fifty issues if you haven't twigged that's how things are... (for the record I fully expect that should MTMTE reach its target of issue 100 we will still have many of the same cast members) Besides, the Skids stuff is what this is all about in terms of looking back - what did he experience, what was his part in all this has been a key plotline since issue 10 or so. Its not just about who Roller is but about who Skids is.

However - there's no getting past the mess that is the follow up from last issue. Unless there is something very specific that was in the last issue that will build to something else, surely the whole thing could have happened with Tailgate having an accident which makes him awaken Thunderclash. Otherwise it seems like a huge amount of guff for very little reward. Also felt this issue could have been stretched over 2 issues - not just to give things a bt more base (Magnus having issues with Froid and Sunder being on board seems so throwaway, as is Froids sudden appearance itself) but also to help pace the events - it all happens at such a frantic pace that I felt it suffers, even though the overall effect was good.

Will I be so bold as to say that this issue and the last feel like the first big mis steps in MTMTE? I don't mean that they are the worst issues as such but the normally well ploted out sense of control doesn't feel so much in play. Maybe this is Roberts trying to out smart the smart fans who pick apart all his work and figure things out before the reveal but if that's the case, I don't think its had an overly positive effect on the comic. This has all felt a bit too rushed with events not happening as organically as they normally would and there's a great feeling of forced events to provoke a reader reaction here. Maybe in a rush to make the events of issue 50 be a landmarked he has had to skip an issue that would have set things up better. Who knows.

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Sat Dec 26, 2015 9:57 pm

well if the signs and portents are correct, issue 50 and it's follow ups are going to involve the DJD heavily. The DJD were sent on a collision course with Megatron at the end of issue 39, and we're now at 48. It seems to me that a series of loose ends were tied up, but in doing so those unravelled further loose ends which gives things like the last two issues. As RDP says above, for a series where the plotting has been whip tight for so long to fall apart like this is quite disappointing. And that's not to say that the last two issues have been actively bad, but more like a severe dip in quality compared to the previously established level

Knightdramon · Post by **Knightdramon** » Sat Dec 26, 2015 11:00 pm

Can't really tell what other loose ends are revealed?

It's clear that issue 50 for both series is a landmark [and a double issue], but I think you're reading too much into something that's written as a 2-3 parter that's not been released yet.

Issue 47 appears to be a final conclusion on the "relationship" triangle that has been going on, by revealing it not to be a triangle at all.

Besides the obvious cliffhanger at the time [is Cyclonus alive?], it didn't leave room for more questions that were not immediately answered in this issue.

Getaway and Atomizer arrested? Yes. Pending mystery---are they working solo or part of something bigger?
Cyclonus alive, Tailgate unconscious. Whatever the wave is, it rejuvenated Thunderclash. Pending mystery---um, just what the wave was? Which I'm sure it will be explained soon.

So the immediate questions/loose ends from last issue were set straight this issue.

Now, 48? Obviously it's meant to provide background for both Rung and Skids. It looks [not fully confirmed] that the two-parter will fully reveal what the relationship of Tarn and Skids is, provide a lot of info on Rung and from the looks of it, even feature two more characters [not spoiling for those who have not seen the cover].

It's set up as a two parter, so it won't fully explain or reveal everything from the first part.

For me, the issue I enjoyed the least thus far was the Necrobot issue, followed by the space barnacles two parter. I might be biased as Nightbeat is not my fave bot ever, while Skids and Roller/Tarn score pretty high for me

But even so, it's decent and layered out character and background development through and through. Some of the "mysteries" in S1 took quite, quite some time to fully unravel, so I'm not above storing info away that might be answered after S2 ends. Just the way the book is written.

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Sun Dec 27, 2015 9:42 am

You know what would have worked - except for anyone replacing Skids, but since his self inflicted amnesia is now a *crucial plot point* that can't be helped - is to keep this exactly the same but with the two pages that have annoyed me replaced with one page of Magnus arresting Getaway and one page of Megatron with Tailgate. No Cyclonus, no Thunderclash, maybe even Velocity saying "he's awake" but not explicitly referring to who. It closes up some things from last issue, but leaves things ambiguous enough to be cleared up next time. I just can't over how lazy it felt tbh

Post by **Warcry** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 8:28 pm

inflatable dalek wrote:A very disappointing sequence that may actually be the worst bit of MTMTE to date. It actually felt more like Cliffjumper had written a spoof of the series mocking all the things he doesn't like about it.

My brain refused to believe that scene was for real, it was so hackneyed. I just assumed that it was Tailgate's childish fantasy, until the final panel. For everything to work out so perfectly off-screen, casually wiping away all the consequences of the previous issue, it felt like there had to be a catch, and then their wasn't. I guess I was supposed to care that Tailgate was offline, but really, why? Roberts already played that card, less than two years ago, and we know how main character "death" situations turn out in this comic. I guess it's only fitting that the conclusion to last issue be awful, though, since the issue itself was as well. But I'm left wondering just what, exactly, was the whole point of the last issue at all. Did Roberts have bigger plans for the Tailgate conspiracy that became impossible due to the IDW-mandated big issue #50, so he rushed to tie it off as soon as he could?

On the flip side, Skids was actually interesting here, because for once he's not being treated as an on-so-perfect Mary Sue who can effortlessly do whatever he sets his mind to. And I agree that it was nice to see Rung do some actual therapy on him and see some incremental success.

Unfortunately, the Rung side of the story fell flat for me because the series has failed spectacularly at making me care the slightest bit about Rung or his obligatory-for-a-Roberts-character dark, mysterious past. And I care even less about his rival Froid, or his pet psychotic killer (since, as we've established, nobody who matters ever dies in MTMTE and even if they do we'll see a ton of them in flashbacks anyway). The whole storyline is clearly just there as a way to bring Skids' memories back, but surely we could have gotten there in a less painfully contrived way? One that actually relied on the central cast accomplishing something, rather than random outside forces helpfully showing up at a plot-appropriate time to do it for them?

So overall, this is a better issue than last month's but I'm still left with no idea how this is meant to lead to this "season"'s climax or why I should care about it when it does.

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Thu Dec 31, 2015 8:55 pm

Read through once. And thanks for clearing up that those were Rungs eyes being ripped out. I really couldn't work that out at all. Tiny panels, cramped art and speech bubbles nobble it again for me.

I liked the Froid/ Sunder/ Rung stuff and Skids and all that, that was great, and Sunder is easily one of the most creepy things I've ever seen! Loved that.

As most of you have mentioned, the stuff with Cyclonus and Tailgate was disappointingly undermined in the worst way. It would have been more interesting to deal with Tailgate dealing with Cyclonus dying or something...but then we all half suspected last time that Cyclonus wouldn't die....I dunno. Just, sometimes, its okay that people die, in fiction and it can mean something and matter, otherwise...what's the point of putting those characters in those situations? or at least do that smarter thing what pandagork suggested.

I didn't mind the brief cut-away to Magnus bearing down on Atomizer and Getaway - that felt like an acceptable thing to cut away for this issue to be focused on ...next time (hopefully).

OR EVEN...to have dropped all that entirely and have this issue solely about Skids and have it tie into Tailgate's Spark thingy at the end - as if these events were happening concurrently with that escapade. Possibly (not paid attention to which characters were where last issue).

I think I'll need another couple of passes at this, but agree that suddenly things feel very rushed to get to the big milestone issue. Or, I dunno, James was writing this whilst trying not to burn the cooking.

Octus! And the others! That grizzly claw thing! urgh!!!!!

Red Dave Prime · Post by **Red Dave Prime** » Thu Dec 31, 2015 9:27 pm

OR EVEN...to have dropped all that entirely and have this issue solely about Skids and have it tie into Tailgate's Spark thingy at the end - as if these events were happening concurrently with that escapade. Possibly (not paid attention to which characters were where last issue).

No, I think you've hit things on the head. Things would have read a lot better that way. Would also explain Magnus letting on Froid and Sunder as he was distracted by other events. Maybe that was even the intention.

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:38 am

Im re-reading again and something new has just popped up. Rodimus ordered Chromedome to perform mnemosurgery on Tailgate when Tailgate was out of it, and by the looks of things Megatron didn't agree with it at all. So... when is Rodimus going to *finally* get kicked off the ship?

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:26 am

I felt that was in keeping with Rodimus impaitent, impulsive nature. I do wonder if Megatron's continued comments about how little traction the Lost Light is making are leading Rodimus to make some expedient choices. TBH, it would probably be difficult not to lean on someone with that skillset as a means to an end in some situations. At least he's not making Chromedome re-write someone's personality. Again, it highlights after the Overlord/ Drift fiasco that Rodimus is keen to resolve any criminal activity quickly. Which means Getaway and Atomizer will probably be hanging out with everyone next time

Patapsco · Post by **Patapsco** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 10:48 am

I suppose part of it is Chromedome's insistence that performing the procedure is very dangerous and could kill him only when it suits him. He's perfectly happy to do it for the greater good or to help a friend, but the rest of the time it's like "nope, I could die". I'm presuming there's a reason for it