Transformers Revenge of the Fallen or Terminator Salvation

DirtDigger324 · Post by **DirtDigger324** » Tue Apr 14, 2009 12:03 am

I just wanted to see what you guys think of the two robot heavy movies of the summer. Which one beats out the other or do you think both will be good. I am a fan of Transformers and Terminator and based on the previews I'd say both will be on par adding some different element to each movie experience. So what do you all think?

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:37 pm

I'm hungry.

bowspearer · Post by **bowspearer** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:23 pm

At this stage I'm leaning far more towards Salvation. The first movie was such a train wreck that considering Devastator has been made into a movie monster with a bad apetite, I find myself only interested in it.

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:42 pm

Having now seen them both, I can safely say Transformers. It's so much more fun- Terminator was po-faced without being particularly gripping. It felt like America trying to be british. A british disaster story (triffids, reign of fire, war of the worlds) is about the aftermath, the human drama. Terminator Salvation had a few such promising moments, but in the end boiled down to lots of action scenes which seemed to be there for no other reason than to stop us getting bored. Judgement day is my favourite film ever and Salvation was close to being the film I always imagined when watching the future bits of the earlier films but it was never quite there.
T:ROTF, on the other hand, did not try to be anything other than a big, silly action film. Also, the effects were better. And robots that turn into cars is a better idea. And Arnie was hardly in Salvation whereas Prime was all over revenge of the fallen. And McG is a stupid name

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:54 pm

Normally I'd say not to be mean and judge people by their moniker, but it's McG so I can dig it.

In my eyes the future stuff in Terminator is best left untouched, to be honest. It's like, for example, the heist in Reservoir Dogs - we don't need to see it because that's not really what the story's about and nothing they show can beat what you imagine.

But, to answer the question now I've seen them both, the Bay film. For all the negative things I could say about it if I wanted to, at the end of the day it knew what it was all the way through. Meaning it didn't get confused and think it was Battlestar Galactica for massive chunks.

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 8:37 am

Halfshell wrote:In my eyes the future stuff in Terminator is best left untouched, to be honest. It's like, for example, the heist in Reservoir Dogs - we don't need to see it because that's not really what the story's about and nothing they show can beat what you imagine.

I'm inclined to agree, now that you've said it. I really liked the glimpses they give you in T1 and T2, but I particularly liked how in T1 we never even saw John. T4 was good, as T5 and T6 will no doubt be good, but they'll never live up to T1 and T2 or the T4 that exists in my head.

numbat · Post by **numbat** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:12 am

Summerhayes wrote:I'm inclined to agree, now that you've said it. I really liked the glimpses they give you in T1 and T2, but I particularly liked how in T1 we never even saw John. T4 was good, as T5 and T6 will no doubt be good, but they'll never live up to T1 and T2 or the T4 that exists in my head.

I think everyone thought they wanted to see the future of the Terminator series, but it could never live up to the expectation. (That's not to say it couldn't have been done better...) The dark future, though, was really a plot device - an underlying menace that drove the other films. The idea was this scarey stuff would happen in the future if they didn't get through this impossible situation in the present. The message was a lot more positive. We could change the future. Turns out society is a lot more negative now, and we have decided we can't change the future. Shame.

Pseudo philosophical social ramblings aside, I enjoyed both films. However, there didn't really seem to be a point to Terminator: Salvation, although it seemed to want there to be. I think Marcus is the most compelling character in the franchise - it's just such a shame they wasted him in a film that primarily consisted of a series of disjointed action sequences. They were all fun sequences - but there was no real thread connecting them, and no drive.

Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen, however, not only embraces the fact it is a blockbuster, casting other pretentions aside, but it delivers a thread to connect and drive the sequences as well. There is an underlying threat, and emotional scenes, but at the end of the day, it's happy to be a fun ride.

Transformers will never be serious, and are unlikely to provide a platform for deep social commentary. They are well suited to fun blockbuster flicks.

Terminator did deliver on social commentary in T1 and T2, but, first anf foremost was a horror/thriller franchise. That went by the wayside with T3, and has lapsed further with T4. It's having an identity crisis. What was an intelligent horror series is now a confused and simple popcorn flick. Weird.

Mr_Hi_n_Mitey · Post by **Mr_Hi_n_Mitey** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:51 pm

I would have to say I would vote for T:ROTF as my favorite robot movie. I was glad to see more robots fighting one another this time, and I liked Skids and Mudflap. The Constructions/Devastator were OK; (I still have to get used to them) and the Arcee twins were real nice. I did not like the way T4 played on the issue of genocide and mass incarceration. It also kind of shocked me the way some Humans were being experimented on. It all reminded of a well-known period of evil that happened out here in the REAL world over sixty years ago - you know, the situation that many say did not happen. Also, speaking of robot movies, be on the lookout for a new movie called 9 and SURROGATES - a new movie starring Bruce Willis. I am still trying to see DISTRICT 9 (a movie dealing with aliens) and G. I. JOE: THE RISE OF COBRA (Yo Joe!) myself.

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:57 pm

Machine Hunter wrote:It all reminded of a well-known period of evil that happened out here in the REAL world over sixty years ago

It was probably meant to.

I say probably because I can't actually remember much about T4 at all, other than the botched attempts to be a bit like BSG.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:30 pm

Can you really use the word "many" to describe a tiny percentage?

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:34 pm

Cliffjumper wrote:Can you really use the word "many" to describe a tiny percentage?

Not sure. Is many comparative? I mean there are many species of cat, but in the grand scheme of things, relatively few animals are feline.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:46 pm

Surely it depends on usage? The implication is many deny the Holocaust, and a given value of 'many' do - let's say hundreds of thousands. But when you consider that's a tiny percentage of people... I dunno, would you say many people buy 30 Odd Foot of Grunt albums? I mean, there's a few hundred people who do/did, which is enough to fill a town hall or something, but it's loading the sentence to imply it's something most people do without context... You'd say "Holocaust deniers aren't particularly common, but there are many more than you might think".

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:56 pm

This is it, though, I'm not sure if "many" on its own is a comparative term, or just utterly a subjective synonym for "lots".

I have many adoring fans. But as far as proportionality goes, they're a minority (but only because most of the world don't know me). They're more than me, so compared to me, it's many. I mean if it was me against them in a locked room, I'd clearly get shouted down.

Most, on the otherhand, obviously implies majority.

Holocaust Denial, on the other hand, obviously implies stupidity and I'm not really sure why it was brought up. Series 6 of Peep Show starts on the 18th, I think.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 4:06 pm

Yup, cover of TV & Satellite - w00t!

Shit, sorry, I mean the show's jumped the shark, screwed the pooch, bought the farm, incorporated the theme tune, employed the Tate, left the Travelodge etc. etc. etc. now more than six thousand people watch it. Or now many watch it...?

HeavyArms · Post by **HeavyArms** » Sat Sep 12, 2009 7:32 am

Liked them both, but I'm a far bigger fan of Transformers than Terminator, although Sam Worthington was quite good in it, Moon Bloodgood was reasonably hot in it, but Christian Bale was sounding a bit too Batman-ery for my liking.
I am however hoping tey eventually do sequal that has a human vs Terminator battle, instead of these one on one type of fights.

On the subject of ROTF, can I just say that I hated Skids and Mudflap, it should also have less of the human dialog and more robot fighting.

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:31 pm

HeavyArms wrote: but Christian Bale was sounding a bit too Batman-ery for my liking.

Apparently, Bale demanded a bigger role for John Connor in the film and its therefore his fault the film sucked.

HeavyArms wrote:I hated Skids and Mudflap.

I seem to be in a minority around here for finding them fairly amusing . . . then again, I'm 19 years old so I'm pretty much the target demographic

HeavyArms wrote: less of the human dialog and more robot fighting.

Here, however, I agree wholeheartedly

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:39 pm

Summerhayes wrote:I seem to be in a minority around here for finding them fairly amusing . . . then again, I'm 19 years old so I'm pretty much the target demographic

The more I watch it, the less I mind them - in relative terms they're no more irritating than any of the other 'kid' characters we've had over the years. My only real problem with them is that they get a lot of screentime while not contributing a huge amount beyond jokes, when Sideswipe and Jolt (and even Ironhide and Ratchet) are barely in it.

Felt the human/robot ratio wasn't too bad, apart from odd bits at the desert showdown when the Autobots really didn't seem to be doing that much compared to those three tanks... Oh, and the slightly anti-climactic bit between the death of Prime and the discovery of Jetfire - it could have done with a bit more of the Decepticons running riot on Earth; as it is, they basically kidnap Ron & Judy and sink an aircraft carrier (almost by accident...) and then just sit back - especially weird when you consider how much of a fight they get from a couple of planes full of NEST troops and half-a-dozen Autobots.

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 11:10 am

Cliffjumper wrote:The more I watch it, the less I mind them.

I'm ashamed to admit it, but I get that with Jar Jar Binks. I guess the difference here is that the first Transformers film wasn't exactly A New Hope . . .

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:01 pm

I'd say it was better myself - no Mark Hamill, for one. Always found the original Star Wars a bit meh (the 2nd and 3rd aren't bad, the first one suffers from a) massive, massive overhype and b) a real feeling of "get on with it!").

Jar-Jar's always been Phantom Menace's beard, anyway. There're so many terrible things in that film, Jar-Jar's just one of them. A bit like Wheelie and Daniel in the TF cartoon he's just something easy to beat up and blame as a personification of a bad story.

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:10 am

Your second point was really good, but I just found it going in one ear and out the other after the blasphemy that was your first . . .
The original Star Wars was so good, they can film a shot-for-shot remake with Kirk, Spock and McCoy, swap "Wars" for "Trek" and everyone acts like its the best film ever. Or just swap Jedi for Dragons and call it Eragon.

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Transformers Revenge of the Fallen or Terminator Salvation

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