The Transformers Archive Skip to main content / Also skip section headers

[The Transformers Archive - an international fan site]
Please feel free to log in or register.

 
  • transformers toys
  • transformers comics
  • transformers cartoon
  • transformers live-action movies
  • transformers fandom
  • transformers forum
Old 2016-06-30, 03:13 PM   #1
Warcry
Likes Beast Wars toys. A lot.
 
Warcry's Avatar
 
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Default **** off, Morlocks!

No, seriously. These guys are the worst. How many times are they going to recycle the exact same "Some Morlocks kidnap a character, Masque makes them ugly and they try to force them to stay in the sewers dressed in ripped fetish gear" plot? It was tedious and stupid the first time around when they kidnapped Angel, and they get progressively more annoying with each appearance. Or am I supposed to be eagerly counting down the days until Mutant Massacre?

Get your shit together, Chris-Claremont-from-30-years-ago!

Seriously though, is there much point continuing on with his run after the mid-1980s? I loved the hell out of the first 80 issues or so of him writing the "new" team, but it seems like there's been a noticeable dip in quality not long after Rogue showed up, and now there's ****ing Morlocks every three issues, plots appearing/disappearing half-way through because of crossovers with Secret Wars/New Mutants/whatever the hell else, the writing is leaning really hard on the "mutants are just like black people" crutch and Kitty is really enjoying calling black folks who aren't supportive of the mutant cause "niggers" to make a point. And now the next issue up is apparently them having to rescue Arcade from Doctor Doom, which would sound fun if the exact same plot hadn't already happened four years ago.

Is this just a hiccup, or is it a Budianskyesque "I'm completely out of ideas and don't want to do this anymore but people are going to keep paying me to for another five years!" moment?
 
Warcry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-06-30, 06:24 PM   #2
Skyquake87
One with the Matrix
 
Skyquake87's Avatar
 
Default

Didn't read X-Men around that time, but yeah, Claremont was kept on way longer than he should have been.

My own exposure to the Morlocks was an ill-advised 'guest appearance' in (wait for it) Ghost Rider. I thought they were stupid. And yes, all living underground in filth because they looked funny. And had kidnapped some children because... reasons. Also guessed starred X-Factor .. which confused me as it wasn't the X-Factor I was expecting, but the original X-Men in a flying alien building with a small boy.

Really sucked the gritty urban edge Ghost Rider had going on right out of the book and was one of the most mediocre stories GR ever had. Best bit was when Blackout killed one of the Morlocks. Shame he didn't do them all in, he'd have been doing us all a favour.
 
Skyquake87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-07-01, 11:19 AM   #3
Brendocon 2.0
Mostly Harmless. Mostly.
 
Brendocon 2.0's Avatar
 
UK
Red face

Bestest thing about this thread is that the current arc of Uncanny has the Morlocks in it as well. Albeit they're the ones being kidnapped this time, but y'know, lolz.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyquake87 View Post
Didn't read X-Men around that time, but yeah, Claremont was kept on way longer than he should have been.
And we're not even into that bit yet. It's when he comes back in 2000 that he really starts to take a shit on his own legacy/reputation.

No, seriously, it picks up again. The post Fall of the Mutants stuff in Australia is much better. I think. You're pretty much stuck with sporadic Morlock exposure up until Mutant Massacre (circa #210). Possibly beyond. It's been a while and the bit of my brain that remembers specific old X-details has melted because reasons.

Quote:
Also guessed starred X-Factor .. which confused me as it wasn't the X-Factor I was expecting, but the original X-Men in a flying alien building with a small boy.
Proper X-Factor, yo. From before the "er, I guess we'd better come up with something new so we don't have to cancel the book" years.

And from before the ****ing excellent X-Factor Investigations years.
 
Brendocon 2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-07-04, 04:14 PM   #4
Warcry
Likes Beast Wars toys. A lot.
 
Warcry's Avatar
 
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyquake87 View Post
Really sucked the gritty urban edge Ghost Rider had going on right out of the book and was one of the most mediocre stories GR ever had. Best bit was when Blackout killed one of the Morlocks. Shame he didn't do them all in, he'd have been doing us all a favour.
I've never even heard of this Blackout before, but he's now my hero.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendocon 2.0 View Post
Bestest thing about this thread is that the current arc of Uncanny has the Morlocks in it as well. Albeit they're the ones being kidnapped this time, but y'know, lolz.
Goddammit they're still around after thirty years? You'd think someone would have realized how terrible they are and quietly dropped them from existence in the interim.

And now Cyclops has randomly turned into a neglectful husband and negligent father, a man too busy adventuring to call his pregnant wife for the last month of her pregnancy, and too busy pouting over Xavier disappearing to space with his girlfriend (even though he's already done so at least once before and come back) and fighting what he hoped to be a one-sided duel with Storm than spending any time with his son after he was born. I get that they're trying to "reset" the character so that he can go off and do his X-Factor thing without baggage, but surely they could have found a way to do so that didn't involve complete and utter character assassination?

I don't even like Cyclops but dammit was that uncomfortable to read.
 
Warcry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-07-04, 05:14 PM   #5
Brendocon 2.0
Mostly Harmless. Mostly.
 
Brendocon 2.0's Avatar
 
UK
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warcry View Post
Goddammit they're still around after thirty years? You'd think someone would have realized how terrible they are and quietly dropped them from existence in the interim.
They've not been mentioned in a while and they have basically been used here as a plot device to get to something else. Admittedly that other thing is basically a retread of a GenX plotline from the 90s, but hey ho.

The biggest problem with superhero comics these days is that Marvel own the IP. Which means there's no mileage in a writer actually creating something new when they come onto a book. And why should they? Do a stint for Marvel or DC using the existing toys and then keep any new ideas for a creator-owned series with Image/whoever. Occasionally new concepts do leak in, but overall there's not much incentive to bother coming up with anything genuinely new these days.

So if you're writing a mutant story and you need to go underground for some reason... well, why not grab the Morlocks off the shelf rather than trying to come up with something else.

Quote:
And now Cyclops has randomly turned into a neglectful husband and negligent father, a man too busy adventuring to call his pregnant wife for the last month of her pregnancy, and too busy pouting over Xavier disappearing to space with his girlfriend (even though he's already done so at least once before and come back) and fighting what he hoped to be a one-sided duel with Storm than spending any time with his son after he was born. I get that they're trying to "reset" the character so that he can go off and do his X-Factor thing without baggage, but surely they could have found a way to do so that didn't involve complete and utter character assassination?

I don't even like Cyclops but dammit was that uncomfortable to read.
Yeahhhhh... Cyclops has always been a dick. I feel the key to understanding the character is that "being in charge of the X-Men" is basically all he feels he's good at, to the extent that he'll sabotage everything around him to carry on doing it. New baby? Basically has to be kicked out of the X-Men by Storm in order to go and be a parent, and even then runs off to reform the original team the first opportunity he gets.

It's not behaviour I'll defend or justify... and it's not particularly easy to sit through. But I find in general he's easier to understand when viewed through that lens.

Warren's the rich, pretty one who can fly.
Hank's the smart one AND the strong one.
Bobby's the funny, cool (literally) one.
Jean's the girl one.
And Cyclops is the poor lil orphan who can't look anybody in the eye. So Xavier makes him team leader in order to give him a purpose. And the responsibility completely ****s him up to the point it's the only thing he can do.

Admittedly I'd imagine this was almost certainly never the intention of Stan or Claremont, but as something applied in retrospect it certainly helps.
 
Brendocon 2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-07-05, 07:35 PM   #6
Warcry
Likes Beast Wars toys. A lot.
 
Warcry's Avatar
 
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendocon 2.0 View Post
The biggest problem with superhero comics these days is that Marvel own the IP. Which means there's no mileage in a writer actually creating something new when they come onto a book. And why should they? Do a stint for Marvel or DC using the existing toys and then keep any new ideas for a creator-owned series with Image/whoever. Occasionally new concepts do leak in, but overall there's not much incentive to bother coming up with anything genuinely new these days.
That's a part of the problem, but only part of it. There'd be a lot less motivation to save the good ideas for creator-owned stuff if the Marvel and DC were still capable of selling comics at the same level as the 80s or 90s. Then there'd be a financial motivation for the writers to stay on high-profile books and give it their all.

There's also the problem of so many writers these days being fanboys who want to reset the status quo on their books to something resembling what they enjoyed as kids, throwing out a lot of the previous writers ideas, changes and characters in the process. Add the fact that the audience has been boiled down to hardcore fanboys with the same urges and you get an ugly feedback loop where nothing ever changes because too many people involved on both sides of the equation are motivated by nostalgia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendocon 2.0 View Post
Yeahhhhh... Cyclops has always been a dick. I feel the key to understanding the character is that "being in charge of the X-Men" is basically all he feels he's good at, to the extent that he'll sabotage everything around him to carry on doing it. New baby? Basically has to be kicked out of the X-Men by Storm in order to go and be a parent, and even then runs off to reform the original team the first opportunity he gets.
That's true, but it annoys me to no end because Claremont kept developing the character in a different direction and writing him as a responsible adult only to chicken out and tug him back. It reads almost like Scott's a drug addict...as long as he's kept away from the X-Men he's perfectly capable of leading a normal, healthy life, but as soon as he's in the same room as them he can't stop himself from throwing on the tights, undermining Storm or whoever else was in charge and trying to play the hero. Dude really should have gone off on the Starjammer with his dad just to get away from the temptation. Which would be great except I'm pretty sure that's not been the intention until maybe the last couple issues.

And what the heck happened to Nightcrawler being team leader? Dude was in charge for like a year's worth of issues. Then Cyclops and Storm both return out of nowhere (explained in issues of a different series I've not read, I'm sure) and are duelling over who gets to be in charge even though one of them has retired three times in the last five years and the other isn't even a mutant anymore. And not a word gets mentioned about Kurt being boss, even though he was doing a bang-up job.

(The best part of the last few issues has been Wolverine's repeated inner monologues -- directed to his own fans and maybe Marvel's editors as well -- about how he'd be a terrible leader and you should stop asking for him to be in charge just because he's popular.)
 
Warcry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-07-08, 06:07 PM   #7
Cyberstrike nTo
Primus
 
Cyberstrike nTo's Avatar
 
In the Dead Universe known as Indianapolis
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendocon 2.0 View Post
Proper X-Factor, yo. From before the "er, I guess we'd better come up with something new so we don't have to cancel the book" years.

And from before the ****ing excellent X-Factor Investigations years.

When X-Factor is written by Peter David it is always awesome, even in 90s when did what 12 issues in 90s and he actually put Baldrick and maybe even a Blackadder (the ex-husband of the government agent running X-Factor IIRC he was named Edmund and looked an awful like Rowan Atkinson if he was African-American) in the damn thing and it's pretty funny. I'm surprised that BBC hasn't sued Marvel over it...yet.
 



The X-WCW a fun site for fun people.
Cyberstrike nTo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
 
 
[the-hub.co.uk]
[transfans.co.uk]
[oneshallstand]
[unicron.com]
[counter-x.net]
[ntfa.net]
[allspark.com]
[transformertoys.co.uk]
[tfu.info]
[botchthecrab.com]
[obscure_tf]
[tfradio.net]
 

[TFArchive button]
Link graphics...

BOOKMARK US
Or in FF, hit Ctrl+D.